Gun Laws - Teh Forum

<body> <div id="header"> <span class="left"> <span class="back"><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=DEFAULT"><span class="image mobile_back" title="Back"></span></a></span> <span class="image mobile_logo" title="Beehive Forum Logo"></span> </span> <ul> <li> <a class="reply_all" href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.0&return_msg=41226.28"> <span class="image mobile_reply_all"></span><span class="text">Reply to All</span> </a> </li> <li> <a class="navigation" href="#"> <span class="image mobile_navigation"></span><span class="text">Show messages</span> </a> </li> <li> <a class="main" href="#"><span class="image mobile_menu" title="Menu"></span> </a> </li> </ul> </div> <div class="menu main"> <ul> <li><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Messages</a></li> <li><a href="lpm.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Inbox</a></li> <li><a href="lsearch.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Search</a></li> <li><a href="llogon.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Login</a></li> </ul> </div> <div class="menu navigation"><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.1">1–10</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.11">11–20</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.21">21–30</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.31">31–40</a>…<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.171">171–177</a></div> <div id="page_content"> <h3 class="thread_title"><a href="index.php?webtag=DEFAULT&amp;msg=41226.28">Gun Laws</a> </h3> <div id="messages" data-navigation="41226_28_177_10"> <a name="a41226_28"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_28"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Drew (X3N0PH0N)<span class="message_time"> 4 Oct 2014 15:16</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: fixrman <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 5 Oct 2014 03:08"></span></span> <span class="message_count">28 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.28">41226.28</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.24">41226.24</a></div> <div class="message_body"> <div class="quotetext"><strong>Quote:</strong> </div> <div class="quote"><span style="font-size:13px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);">Take away guns, people kill with sharp instruments. Unfortunately, more fodder for the "people kill people" argument.</span></div> <br /> That people will always kill people is not in question. <em>Given</em> that we know people will always kill people, why make it easier by giving them guns?<br /><br /> There are stats <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate">here</a> for intentional murders per country (note they're adjusted for population, they're per 100k). The USA is far from the highest but has nearly 5x the murder rate of the UK. That's not all down to gun ownership of course (though 66% of single-victim murders and 79% of multiple victim murders in the US are with firearms (67% overall)) but to say "people will kill people regardless" like it's something we can't do anything about is ridiculous.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.28&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.28"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_29"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_29"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: ANT_THOMAS<span class="message_time"> 4 Oct 2014 16:07</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: fixrman <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 5 Oct 2014 03:08"></span></span> <span class="message_count">29 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.29">41226.29</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.24">41226.24</a></div> <div class="message_body"> I made a long reply to this but Teh crashed <span class="emoticon e_csad" title=":C"><span class="e__">:C</span></span><br /><br /> I might retype it later.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.29&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.29"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_30"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_30"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Ken (SHIELDSIT)<span class="message_time"> 4 Oct 2014 16:54</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ALL<span class="message_count">30 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.30">41226.30</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Don't get me started, or I'll come over there and show you why we have guns! <span class="emoticon e_grin" title=":-D"><span class="e__">:-D</span></span> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.30&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.30"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_31"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_31"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Ken (SHIELDSIT)<span class="message_time"> 4 Oct 2014 16:55</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Drew (X3N0PH0N) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 4 Oct 2014 17:28"></span></span> <span class="message_count">31 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.31">41226.31</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.4">41226.4</a></div> <div class="message_body"> I won't let it slip that I included guns with your last keyboard shipment.<br /><br /> Whoops!</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.31&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.31"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_32"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_32"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Drew (X3N0PH0N)<span class="message_time"> 4 Oct 2014 17:29</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Ken (SHIELDSIT) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 4 Oct 2014 17:32"></span></span> <span class="message_count">32 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.32">41226.32</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.28#a41226_31" target="_self">41226.31</a></div> <div class="message_body"> <span class="emoticon e_cheering" title="(cheer)"><span class="e__">(cheer)</span></span></div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.32&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.32"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_33"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_33"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: DeannaG (CYBATRON)<span class="message_time"> 5 Oct 2014 03:03</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ALL<span class="message_count">33 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.33">41226.33</a></div> <div class="message_body"> I see a lot of people saying the only reason an ordinary person wants a gun is to kill someone.<br /><br /> Well, let me tell you a little history in my house.<br /><br /> When my daughter was five a drugged up guy broke into our home in the middle of the night, while we we're sleeping. I didn't have a gun. All I had was a crowbar and a small child to protect. He started down the hallway to her room and I closed on him and started whacking with all my strength. I went straight for his head, and luckily got it. The second he hit the floor I just kept hitting him.<br /><br /> One of my neighbors was awoken by the screaming and called the cops. The neighbor was seventy-five at the time. So he couldn't come over and help. It took the police nearly ten minutes to arrive. In which time, I got to listen to my daughter screaming for me in her bed while I was trying to keep this guy on the floor and away from her. A guy who easily had fifty pounds on me. If he'd managed to get up, I shudder to think.<br /><br /> During this encounter, he was less than six feet from my child. My baby! I'd like to know what all of you think he would have done to us if I hadn't been lucky enough to put him down? If I had a gun back then, he wouldn't have had any knee caps, but he also wouldn't have been able to get so close to my baby. The only thing between them was a thin bedroom door. I couldn't even get to her without stepping over him.<br /><br /> Another thing, a lot of my family hunts, and we eat what we hunt. There are a lot of Americans who engage in this activity to help feed their families. I know some who hunt for sport, and give the meat to the poor.<br /><br /> The people who shouldn't have guns are the criminals, mentally unstable, and the irresponsible and improperly trained. I agree gun control is too lax, but I don't agree with taking guns away from responsible, properly trained, honest citizens. People who may find themselves in a situation as I did, or those who actually use their guns to help feed their families. Such as responsible, legal, properly trained hunters.<br /><br /> Those of you who cannot have guns in your country, I do feel bad for you at times. If someone breaks into your home and you cannot escape or call for help, or help takes too long to get there, what are you going to do? Drop to your knees and beg for your life and the lives of your family?<br /><br /> The police don't always make it in time. Sometimes you have to take responsibility for yourself and those you love. You don't have to kill someone to protect yourself or your family, but you do have to have the tools and knowledge on how to do it, or you might as well dig a hole.<br /><br /> I'm sorry to be so harsh, but when I think about what he could have done to us, and how long it took for help to arrive, I'm glad I have a gun now. If something so horrible ever happens again, I can at least protect us. I'm not so young anymore. The crowbar isn't an option. If it happened now, and I didn't have a gun, I'd be dead and the police would be making an outline in my house. <span class="emoticon e_sad" title=":-("><span class="e__">:-(</span></span><br /><br /> I do agree that not everyone should have guns. Some are not fit and some are too irresponsible. If you do have to shoot someone to protect yourself or your loved ones, I say take out the feet or knees. When the police finally arrive to take them away, they'll be nice enough to call an ambulance for them. <span class="emoticon e_wink" title=";-)"><span class="e__">;-)</span></span><br /><br /> Deanna</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.33&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.33"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_34"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_34"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: fixrman<span class="message_time"> 5 Oct 2014 03:17</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Drew (X3N0PH0N) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 5 Oct 2014 17:15"></span></span> <span class="message_count">34 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.34">41226.34</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.28#a41226_28" target="_self">41226.28</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Bah! Ban knives in the U.K., then tell me about murder rates in the United States. Like I believe you said, this is a useless<br /> discussion. Ban guns, people kill with knives. Then ban knives and they kill with rattail combs, sharpened sticks, stiletto heels, bare hands, ligatures, piano wire, poison... the list is endless.<br /><br /> With the number of guns that we have in the U.S. we should have by your thinking eliminated ourselves already. There are more sane and responsible people here than you give credit for. I am beginning to think that your vehemence stems from jealousy. What do you think I can do about it? Petition Harry Reid.<br /><br /> BTW, adjusted for per 100K is bullshit and you know it.<br /><br /> My serious question to you is, living over there: Why do you care how many guns Americans have?<br /><br /> We have guns because we want them. We hunt with them, we use them for personal protection, we target shoot with them. Most Americans do not have an idea that they want to kill another human being with them. If you lived over here, maybe your argument would have more merit, but telling us we shouldn't have them because people over there were too weak-willed to keep them is no basis for an argument why we should not have them. BTW, I have read articles from over there and in Australia and there are plenty of folks who are sorry they ever gave up their firearms. If you don't want one, don't go through the aggravation of getting one. I won't sneer at you, look down on your or tell you you are wrong for not having one. It is your choice.<br /><br /> I think I will go looking for a Heckler and Koch Semi-Automatic soon. I am feeling oppressed.<div class="edit_text">EDITED: 5 Oct 2014 03:24 by FIXRMAN</div> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.34&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.34"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_35"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_35"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: fixrman<span class="message_time"> 5 Oct 2014 03:17</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ANT_THOMAS <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 5 Oct 2014 08:22"></span></span> <span class="message_count">35 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.35">41226.35</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.28#a41226_29" target="_self">41226.29</a></div> <div class="message_body"> OK.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.35&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.35"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_36"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_36"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Monsoir (PILOTDAN)<span class="message_time"> 5 Oct 2014 08:48</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: fixrman <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 5 Oct 2014 10:57"></span></span> <span class="message_count">36 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.36">41226.36</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.28#a41226_34" target="_self">41226.34</a></div> <div class="message_body"> You started the fucking thread, for crying out loud. It's no good beginning a debate and throwing your toys out of the pram when it doesn't go your way.<br /> <br /> Saying we can't have our say because we dont live there is an argument completely without merit, especially on a UK forum.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.36&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.36"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41226_37"></a><div class="message" id="message_41226_37"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: milko<span class="message_time"> 5 Oct 2014 10:46</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Monsoir (PILOTDAN) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 5 Oct 2014 19:50"></span></span> <span class="message_count">37 of 177</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.37">41226.37</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41226.28#a41226_36" target="_self">41226.36</a></div> <div class="message_body"> I'm sure we can all say whatever we want, but the point is nobody's going to have their mind changed. We've been here before!</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41226.37&return_msg=41226.28" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41226.37"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div></div> <div class="message_page_footer"> <ul> <li class="right_col"><form accept-charset="utf-8" method="get" action="lmessages.php" target="_self"><input type="hidden" name="webtag" id="webtag" class="bhinputtext" value="DEFAULT" dir="ltr" /><input type="hidden" name="msg" id="msg" class="bhinputtext" value="41226.38" dir="ltr" /><input type="submit" name="submit" id="keep_reading" value="Keep reading…" class="button" /></form></li> </ul> </div> </div> </body>