Pangolins - Teh Forum

<body> <div id="header"> <span class="left"> <span class="back"><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=DEFAULT"><span class="image mobile_back" title="Back"></span></a></span> <span class="image mobile_logo" title="Beehive Forum Logo"></span> </span> <ul> <li> <a class="reply_all" href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.0&return_msg=42483.9"> <span class="image mobile_reply_all"></span><span class="text">Reply to All</span> </a> </li> <li> <a class="navigation" href="#"> <span class="image mobile_navigation"></span><span class="text">Show messages</span> </a> </li> <li> <a class="main" href="#"><span class="image mobile_menu" title="Menu"></span> </a> </li> </ul> </div> <div class="menu main"> <ul> <li><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Messages</a></li> <li><a href="lpm.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Inbox</a></li> <li><a href="lsearch.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Search</a></li> <li><a href="llogon.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Login</a></li> </ul> </div> <div class="menu navigation"><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.1">1–10</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.11">11–20</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.21">21–24</a></div> <div id="page_content"> <h3 class="thread_title"><a href="index.php?webtag=DEFAULT&amp;msg=42483.9">Pangolins</a> </h3> <div id="messages" data-navigation="42483_9_24_10"> <a name="a42483_9"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_9"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Peter (BOUGHTONP)<span class="message_time">29 Oct 2019 14:43</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: CHYRON (DSMITHHFX) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 29 Oct 2019 15:15"></span></span> <span class="message_count">9 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9">42483.9</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.8">42483.8</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Google's Image Search has improved a huge amount since I last tried it - now it actually returns living creatures of similar shape instead of just photos that are the same colours - but it still gives a lot of wrong answers and doesn't say anything about the species. <p>Merlin appears to be mobile-only spyware. </p><p>BugFinder is an overly crude tool that only works for North America. (Though it did tell me one of my beetles looks like a Soldier Beetle.) </p><p><a href="https://uk.whatbird.com">https://uk.whatbird.com</a> is the least worst bird identifier I've found - it's often frustratingly slow and not easy to use, and its example images can differ from what an image search returns, (so potential matches need to be checked twice).</p><div class="edit_text">EDITED: 29 Oct 2019 16:08 by BOUGHTONP</div> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.9&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.9"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_10"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_10"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Peter (BOUGHTONP)<span class="message_time">29 Oct 2019 15:16</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: CHYRON (DSMITHHFX) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 29 Oct 2019 16:09"></span></span> <span class="message_count">10 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.10">42483.10</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.8">42483.8</a></div> <div class="message_body"> The general problem with these magic AI image matching services is their assumption of infallibility - they don't tell you which criteria they use and allow a human to tell them which ones are correct and which should be discounted. <p>For example, Wolfram's answer to one image (containing a hoverfly) is that it's an "<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Africanized_bee">Africanized bee</a>" - despite that only existing in South America and southern US, (not to mention the image <em>quite clearly</em> being a fly and not a bee). </p><p>Google's answer for the same image is a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short-tailed_blue">Short-tailed Blue</a>, which at least gets the correct family of the butterfly, if not the right genus (it's actually a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holly_blue">Holly Blue</a>). </p><p>(Side-note: If I didn't know they were both wrong, the fact that the Short-tailed Blue isn't found on the American content would be evidence that one of them was incorrect.) </p><p>Neither Wolfram nor Google gave any hint of recognising more than one thing in the image. Neither of them get me closer to identifying the pink-flowered bush the two insects are on.</p><div class="edit_text">EDITED: 29 Oct 2019 15:17 by BOUGHTONP</div> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.10&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.10"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_11"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_11"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: CHYRON (DSMITHHFX)<span class="message_time">29 Oct 2019 16:11</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Peter (BOUGHTONP) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 29 Oct 2019 23:23"></span></span> <span class="message_count">11 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.11">42483.11</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_10" target="_self">42483.10</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Have you tried crowd-sourcing the ids on insect|bird forums etc?</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.11&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.11"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_12"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_12"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Peter (BOUGHTONP)<span class="message_time">29 Oct 2019 23:23</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: CHYRON (DSMITHHFX) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 29 Oct 2019 23:49"></span></span> <span class="message_count">12 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.12">42483.12</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_11" target="_self">42483.11</a></div> <div class="message_body"> On Monday I photographed over a dozen different species; I need a more scalable solution than uploading images, asking people and waiting for a reply. <p>My ideal solution would be an open source Lightroom plugin that did image recognition for the basics, then asked questions for the bits it's not certain about, and worked fully offline. </p><p>What I expect I'm going to have to do instead is spend a significant amount of money on a stack of books that will then become a constant source of getting in my way.</p></div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.12&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.12"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_13"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_13"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: CHYRON (DSMITHHFX)<span class="message_time">29 Oct 2019 23:52</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Peter (BOUGHTONP) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 31 Oct 2019 13:41"></span></span> <span class="message_count">13 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.13">42483.13</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_12" target="_self">42483.12</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Books are underrated, these days. Go with the books.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.13&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.13"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_14"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_14"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: graphitone<span class="message_time">30 Oct 2019 09:32</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Peter (BOUGHTONP) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 31 Oct 2019 13:41"></span></span> <span class="message_count">14 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.14">42483.14</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_12" target="_self">42483.12</a></div> <div class="message_body"> You tried the library?</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.14&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.14"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_15"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_15"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Peter (BOUGHTONP)<span class="message_time">18 Nov 2019 14:08</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ALL<span class="message_count">15 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.15">42483.15</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Wolfram thinks this is a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycopodium_obscurum">Lycopodium obscurum</a>. <br />Google says <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juniper">Juniper</a> tree. <p>If I could tell them it was found in Pembrokeshire woodland they'd know those answers were wrong. </p><p>But I can't, so I'm back to guessing unknown attributes and scrolling through an endless haze of mature pink flowers trying to figure out if any of them match what this bastard thing might become. </p><p><span class="emoticon e_angry" title=":@"><span class="e__">:@</span></span></p></div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.15&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.15"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_16"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_16"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Peter (BOUGHTONP)<span class="message_time">18 Nov 2019 14:18</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ALL<span class="message_count">16 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.16">42483.16</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_15" target="_self">42483.15</a></div> <div class="message_body"> "This" being a photo that refuses to attach, which probably means there's something wrong with thumbnail generation.</div> <div class="message_attachments"> <span>Attachments:</span> <ul> <li><span class="image attach"></span><a href="get_attachment.php?webtag=DEFAULT&hash=3c60021a0ddeaf0ee0fa2493b4a31028&filename=1611.zip" target="_blank">1611.zip</a></li> </ul> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.16&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.16"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_17"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_17"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: ANT_THOMAS<span class="message_time">18 Nov 2019 16:15</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Peter (BOUGHTONP) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 18 Nov 2019 17:11"></span></span> <span class="message_count">17 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.17">42483.17</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_15" target="_self">42483.15</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Holcus lanatus</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.17&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.17"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a42483_18"></a><div class="message" id="message_42483_18"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Peter (BOUGHTONP)<span class="message_time">18 Nov 2019 17:37</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ANT_THOMAS <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 18 Nov 2019 17:45"></span></span> <span class="message_count">18 of 24</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.18">42483.18</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=42483.9#a42483_17" target="_self">42483.17</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Commonly known as Yorkshire fog, (plus a bunch of other names). It certainly looks like that, and is supported by Wikipedia's assertion of <i>"Holcus lanatus in its natural habitat is a food source for butterflies such as the speckled wood..."</i> - because that's what the flying caterpillar sitting on it is. <p>Thanks. <span class="emoticon e_smile" title=":)"><span class="e__">:)</span></span></p></div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=42483.18&return_msg=42483.9" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="42483.18"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div></div> <div class="message_page_footer"> <ul> <li class="right_col"><form accept-charset="utf-8" method="get" action="lmessages.php" target="_self"><input type="hidden" name="webtag" id="webtag" class="bhinputtext" value="DEFAULT" dir="ltr" /><input type="hidden" name="msg" id="msg" class="bhinputtext" value="42483.19" dir="ltr" /><input type="submit" name="submit" id="keep_reading" value="Keep reading…" class="button" /></form></li> </ul> </div> </div> </body>